James Cameron on Writing the Three AVATAR Sequels Back-to-Back-to-Back

by     Posted 170 days ago

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Last night at the Hero Complex Film Festival, filmmaker James Cameron was on hand to discuss his seminal action/sci-fi masterpieces The Terminator and Terminator 2: Judgment Day. The course of conversation took a turn though to Cameron’s new hopefully equally seminal-in-the-making action/sci-fi trilogy: Avatar. Cameron hired three writers to collaborate on each of the three upcoming sequels (Josh Friedman, Rick Jaffa & Amanda Silver and Shane Salerno), in an effort to get all the films ready to be shot back-to-back-to-back later this year. Last night, Cameron delved into the process behind writing these three sequels simultaneously. For Cameron’s revealing thoughts on the matter and how television gave him the idea in the first place, hit the jump.

James Cameron on writing the Avatar sequels back-to-back-to-back:

avatar-sequels-james-cameronWe tried an experiment. We set ourselves a challenge of writing three films at the same time. I knew I could certainly write any one of them but to write three in some reasonable amount of time – we wanted to shoot them together so we couldn’t start one until all three scripts were done and approved. So I knew I was going to have to ‘parallel process’ which meant I would have to work with other writers. And the best experience I had working with other writers was in television when I did Dark Angel. The television room is a highly collaborative and fun experience. So we put together a team, three teams actually — one for each script. The teams consist of me and another writer on each one of those three films. Each [individual writer] would have their own script that they’re responsible for. But what we did that was unique beforehand was we sat in a writing room for five-months eight-hours-a-day and we worked out every beat of the story across all three films so it all connects as one three film saga. I didn’t tell [the three writers] which sequel was going to be theirs to write until the very last day. So everybody was equally invested story-wise in all three films. So the guy that got the third movie, which is the middle film of this new trilogy, he now knows what preceded and what follows out of what he’s writing at any given moment. We all consider that to be a really exciting, creative and groundbreaking experiment in screenwriting. It worked as a process to get our minds around this epic and all these new creatures and environments and characters. 

Avatar 2 is expected to hit theaters December 2016, followed by Avatar 3 and Avatar 4 the following year(s) afterwards.  Click here for all our previous Avatar coverage.

For more with Cameron:

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  • kps

    If the scripts are as clever and original as the first one, they could have churned out a dozen more.

    • MJ

      Agreed.

      • Hit by the realness

        You guys are a bunch of jealous-ass pussy haters. I can’t stand coming to these messages boards and reading straight up pussies like MJ and KPS hatin on greatness because they couldn’t write their fucking names on their mammy’s welfare cheques but have the motherfucking AUDACITY to talk smack about a motherfucking genius that puts out that highest grosses movie of all times every times. What a bunch of wannabe hater poser ass fake ass bitch ass loser ass dumbfuckers. Cameron has enough money to literally pay you to fuck your grandfathers in front of your mothers and tip you enough to ensure you motherfucking smile while you do it. All from money he made on making UNQUESTIONABLY genius genre films that everyone in the world wants to see multiple times. BOW DOWN wannabes. I hope the snarky comments you made on his article makes you feel like big men at your jobs scrubbing toilets pussy losers. [drops mike and walks offstage]

      • WACKJACK

        Hey u stole my drops mic and walks off stage exit!!!!!

      • MJ

        You obviously can’t read, because if you had actually paid attention here you would know that I love Cameron and Avatar and Titanic, and have defended him here as a genius.

        Go back to masturbating with your porn now, please….

    • M kay

      Clever and original, I am really hoping I missed the sarcasm. All it was was Dances with Wolves in Space. It is the most typical script ever. The movie just looked really good.

      • suckit

        No, stop talking like the other robots…SO many stories have been recycled there is not siginificance to pointing out this one other than to be jealous of its success which is the only reason why u all do so.

      • Sweet Pea

        The fact you DID miss the sarcasm and had to ask is, frankly, astounding… And means you really have no right to enter this discussion, let alone try and bag on James Cameron for not coming out with a 100% original plot arc… Yes the story arc in Avatar has been seen many times; undercover / double-agent goes native, grows to see the error of his ways & hate his old self and finds redemption in helping the good guys fight the bad guys (and his old team). However it has never been done on the scale, in the groundbreaking native 3D or in the incredibly easy and enjoyable to watch blockbuster movie-making that James Cameron always brings to the theaters. Sorry but $2.8B does not lie, people loved the movie and word-of-mouth was immense, you are very much in the minority my sarcasm-blind friend…

  • Royale With Cheese

    Wouldn’t it be “tetralogy” and “four” additional writers by your count?

  • TigerFIST

    I’m excited!

    • Manuel Orozco

      Me too

    • MJ

      Me as well

  • Frank

    I feel like this is going to induce another case of sequel fatigue. When these movies come back from a lengthy hiatus, it’s exciting at first, but when they then proceed to start churning out countless sequels in a short time frame, you just lose interest so quickly. I think the same is going to happen with Star Wars and their plan for yearly iterations… at some point it’s going to be like “another year, another Star Wars.”

    I think Nolan’s Batman movies hit the sweet spot with a sequel every three or four years.

    • MJ

      It can work:

      Lord of the Rings

      • The Flobbit

        You’re missing something: The Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit are actually great movies. Avatar was shiny eye-candy (PS: look back at it: the CGI is really dated).

      • MJ

        Flobbit, I would start over our discussion on The Hobbit again, but what’s the point — we will each have to post 5 more times and will not cede anything, right? :-)

        The CGI in Avatar was groundbreaking at the time, and was done by much of the same crew at WETA that is now doing The Hobbit, and many of which worked on LOTR. Are you claiming that Joe Letteri, the WETA Academy Award winning special effects lead of LOTR, King Kong, Avatar and the current Hobbit movies delivered a poor effort on Avatar? WTF? He won the Oscar for that effort, dude. Come on now…he’s your Hobbit special effects lead, and is arguably the top special effects person on planet Earth today. You can’t have your cake and eat it to here — AVATAR HAD THE SAME SPECIAL EFFECTS TEAM AS ON THE CURRENT HOBBIT FILMS…THAT’S A FACT!

      • FUCK MJ

        Fuck you MJ, pseudo-intellectual poseur bitch. You’re too dumb to fool anyone into thinkin you’re smart so fucking stop with your tired shit already.

      • The Flobbit

        Of course the CGI in Avatar was ground breaking at the time. It looked great. For 2009. In the same way that the original King Kong looked great, and the original Superman looked great…and then became outdated.

        Joe Letteri did a terrific job on Avatar, just as he is doing a terrific job on The Hobbit and Planet of the Apes. But in 5-6 years, people will look back at Caesar, Smaug, Gollum, the Hulk, and Optimus Prime and realize how out-dated they’ve become. It’s just a fact.

        Let me state again: Joe Letteri did a great job!

      • Displa[er

        That may be true, but the framing and composition of said CGI is most certainly not dated. On a purely perfunctory filmmaking level, it still holds up. That said, the dialogue and characterisation is still shit. Hopefully, with all of this attention paid to script writing, that will not be the case here.

      • The Flobbit

        Absolutely. My point is that if Avatar was released today, there would be no hoopla about the visual effects like there was 5 years ago. It’s hugely impressive and imaginative, but it’s been outpassed by Weta’s later efforts.

      • Displa[er

        I agree to an extent, and I’ll concede to your point. Cameron’s forward-thinking ingenuity and idiosyncratic eye as a filmmaker is what ultimately stands the test of time. Avatar undoubtedly pushed the envelope for effects tech across the board, and it’s a bit of a moot point since any idea or invention can reasonably be considered a mere stepping stone in a much larger systemic process, iterating on past achievements (and failures). So lets just kiss the man’s feet and be done with it. On second thought, I’ll withold that affectation until we get a proper Battle Angel Alita adaptation.

      • MJ

        What is the point of this statement of yours? If you put these Hobbit movies in the can for five years, and then released them in 2019, then we’d also expect the top genre movies in 2019 to have better special effects than the Hobbit.

        Duh! So what?

        The 2019 iphone will be more advanced than the 2014 iphone. That’s fracking obvious!!! LOL And the point of that is???

      • The Flobbit

        But we can watch LOTR 12 years later, and the CGI still holds up perfectly. Same with the first Star Wars movies and Jurassic Park. Avatar has dated more than these, and it shows.

      • idiots ‘r’ us

        Flobbit needs to buy three things:
        A brain
        A pair of eyes
        and some frakking glasses!

      • Paulb

        I (and many/most critics on RT) would disagree with you about throwing “The Hobbit” into that statement. It’s problem with the two hobbit movies is exactly excessive eye-candy over story. Hell, the namesake is relegated to something slightly less than costar. Not to say it is horrible, just that it is effects over story.
        Avatar was, and is still, amazing eye candy with a comfort-food underlying story and great action. I played it in my 3d home theater just a few weeks ago and there isn’t anything dated in the slightest compared to what is out now (including my 2 Hobbit discs).

      • The Flobbit

        I know I won’t convince you, so why even argue? But I have to disagree. The Hobbit films are superior to Avatar. They have a great cast, great visuals, excellent action, and a great score. Plus a lot of passion poured into them by a talented team, and the mocap was, by this time, perfected to a new level.

        Avatar was great eye candy with a generic story and generic action. I can’t remember a single action scene, now that I think of it (except for Tsu’tey jumping off that plane and shooting arrows at the same time). It had a forgettable cast (honestly, it takes an announcement on this site to remind my Sam Whatshisface exists) and a cliched environmental message. Overhyped and overrated, which is NOT to say it’s a bad movie.

      • Displa[er

        I would point out every action sequence involving Stephen Lang, he honestly made the movie for me.

      • The Flobbit

        Stephen Lang played Stephen Lang, and that was awesome, because he’s Stephen Lang and no other reason!

      • Hit By Truth

        NEWSFLASH: if you’re staunchly christian nobody wants to listen to your opinion because you’re retarded. PS: you’ll never ever FUCKING EVER come close to making a fraction of what cameron made off his least successful film if you worked your whole life at your piss poor job, which is why you hate genius. Nobody wants to hear a bible molesters retarded opinion on film or fucking anything, really. You’re fucking really sad bro. But keep thumpin that bible, Jesus will reward you in heaven. FUCKING LOL! hahahahahahhaha.

      • The Flobbit

        Dear Hit by Truth,

        You are too mind-numbingly idiotic to compose a dignified reply to. Go jump under a moving bus.

        Love,
        The Internet

      • Displa[er

        Hit by illiteracy. Zing.

      • Lulz at Flobbit
      • DjangoBro

        The Hobbit movies are not great movies… LMFAO Avatar’s CGI is dated?! It still looks a lot better than both of The Hobbits! You are such a troll lmaooo

    • Displa[er

      YOU lose interest. Please don’t speak for the rest of us. I don’t mean to offend, but you may be confusing your own personal reservations with what is plainly in front of you. Cameron’s mindset in relation to this sort of production model is clearly an authorial, intrinsic one i.e. how best to tell the story at hand. As stated in the aforementioned transcript, it’s the motivating force of the entire script writing process for all three films, and therefore symptomatic on a storytelling level. I wouldn’t worry too much about sequel fatigue, as this is clearly a holistic vision through and through.

    • DjangoBro

      This fatigue shit that you speak of doesn’t exist… shut the hell up, please and thank you.

    • mbmarquis69

      The Harry Potter series wasn’t hurt by a quick succession of releases, although those films did have a built in fan base for the books.

    • Fatigue

      Seriously… releasing ONE movie per year will cause “fatigue” …that’s a pretty stupid comment. Do you watch TV? They release an episode every week, yet people still watch… amazing.

    • Fays Palm

      COUNTLESS? My god, you can’t even count to four??
      I almost feel sorry for you. Almost.

  • Manuel Orozco

    We’ll just have to see if these ideas will be as spectacular as the first movie

  • dodge hickey

    Not a big fan of Cameron as a person, no deny his knack for perfectionism in his films though.

    • axalon

      The dude is a visionary through and through

      • MJ

        Well said. Gotta love all of the folks here who had wet dreams when the piss-poor ASM2 came out, now taking their pot shots at JC.

        :-))

      • dodge hickey

        If that was a dig at me then jokes on you, I didn’t see AMS2…

      • MJ

        No, didn’t mean you.

      • dodge hickey

        T2 is one of the best sequels I’ve ever seen, I love going back to it every year.

      • The Flobbit

        Not to mention Aliens, probably the greatest action thriller ever made.

      • dodge hickey

        Aliens was also great, I prefer the quieter atmosphere of Alien though.

      • mbmarquis69

        One of the things that makes Aliens and Alien work so well together is that they are two very different films, set in the same universe. They can be enjoyed for the different approach and tone they bring to their stories. Cameron also did some great things with Terminator 2. He made Linda Hamilton’s character into a (somewhat) crazy badass, and made Arnold a good guy.

        When it comes to sequels, Cameron has already proven that he can mix things up enough to keep a sequel not only entertaining, but damn interesting and unpredictable. I’m not sure this guarantees that the next Avatar sequels will accomplish this, but it gives me more hope than not.

      • Displa[er

        I’ve always found the similarities in tone between Terminator and Alien to be quite interesting, especially when held up against their respective second entries. In terms of expanding the scope and mythology, showcasing badass female heroines, as well as shifting the tone slightly in favor of the more grandiose spectacle; the franchises share a very symbiotic bond for me.

        For the record – Alien (for me) stands alone as having arguably the greastest build-up of tension ever. And the way Sigourney Weaver solidifies her arc by the end, just sells it every time. It’s no wonder Cameron was as inspired as he was.

      • The Flobbit

        Both have their pros: Alien is one of the greatest build-ups of tension and mood in cinema, with some freaky creature design, while Aliens has balls-out amazing action.

      • Displa[er

        Whoops. Diddo. ^

  • aceshigh

    Cameron may be a prick to work with (there are more than enough stories out there to corroborate that), but he’s undeniably a genius.

    I just wish he wasn’t monopolizing over a decade of his movie-making career on the Avatar universe. The first film was visually spectacular, but I’d much rather see him move on to something else.

    • HeSaidSheSaidMv

      Cameron hasn’t been a “genius” in a long time. He hasn’t made a good movie since True Lies. Ever since then, he’s spent a couple of decades obsessing over two projects. First Titanic, now Avatar.

      • MJ

        True Lies was actually one of his weaker entries. Titanic and Avatar were mega-genius achievements that are now as iconic world-wide as The Wizard of Oz, The Godfather, and Star Wars.

      • aceshigh

        Massive achievement, yes, but Titanic is rather embarrassing from a dialogue and acting perspective.

        I give him a ton of credit for pulling it off technically, and I did enjoy it when it first came out (and yeah, I’m a straight guy), but it doesn’t hold up on repeat viewings.

        True Lies is goofy and misogynistic, but I love the hell out of it.

      • MJ

        It was a fun movie, but the weird relationship with Arnold and Jamie Lee Curtis’s character just didn’t ring true, and actually kind of creeped me out a bit. Tom Arnold saved the movie…and if you need Tom Arnold to save your movie, that is not a good thing.

      • Displa[er

        Come on man, Tom Arnold is pretty damn on-point in True Lies, although to be fair, he can’t seem to stop wiggling his jaw like a spastic every frame of that movie. I can just imagine his thought process at the time – KEEP IT TOGETHER FOR CAMERON!!

      • HeSaidSheSaidMv

        Titanic and Avatar are terrible movies. I don’t care how much they made, they’re mocked for a reason. Cameron fanatics went to see those two movies multiple times a piece. All you have to do is look at their rep now vs when they came out. They are not engrained into people’s memories the way The Wizard of Oz, Godfather, or Star Wars are. I’ll take True Lies over those two bloated bore-fests any day of the week.

      • Harry

        Take it from a 21 year old in which movies are my life (and I’m not here to argue the quality of these films) Titanic is way more relevant to my generation than The Godfather. No one really watches The Godfather unless shown it in a film class. The Wizard of Oz is still remembered, and Star Wars is as popular as ever, but Titanic surpasses The Godfather in terms of engrained into people’s memories. When my generation is in their 50′s, The Godfather will have faded out. Once again, I am not speaking about any of these films qualities, just speaking on relevance.

      • MJ

        Fair enough point.

      • Paulb

        Amusingly, I’ve had a few conversations with teens and 20-something folks who grew up in places like China, where Star Wars isn’t the cultural icon it is in the States, and when they viewed it as (younger adults), they simply didn’t get why there is all the love for it. Effects of course don’t hold up to CG raised folks and the story has a lot of holes and silliness (but of course those of us who were kids during that time love it).
        “Classic” is often just a self-feeding cultural thing.

      • Harry

        Ah, well see every country is different. I would like to see a chart of what is considered classics for each country. I’m sure Frozen in Japan will be one, it’s been #1 at the box office for 12 weeks straight there!

      • MJ

        LOL. You crack me up, dude.

        IMDB:
        True Lies: 7.2
        Titanic: 7.7
        Avatar: 7.9

        RT:
        True Lies: 72
        Titanic: 88
        Avatar 83

        Academy Award Wins
        Titanic: 10
        Avatar: 3
        True Lies: 0…yes, fracking ZERO Oscars from its peers!!!

        Enough said…

      • the king of comedy

        They are remembered movies I agree they are par of pop culture now but in no way they are considered some of the best movies ever made, such as The Wizard of Oz, The Godfather and Star Wars, they are remembered for other reasons, like being the highest grossing movies of all time, their music, enviromental message, use of 3d and Special effects, etc.

      • Harry

        You’re forgetting one thing, though, and I speak of Titanic only. You might not think it, but Titanic was filled with emotion. The whole 90 minute sinking of the ship sequence was one of the best action sequences put to film and a big portion of it was even practical effects. But that all doesn’t matter if there’s no soul, or no emotion. And for me and many others Titanic packed an emotional punch. Many assume people just love Titanic for Jack and Rose. I love it because I can feel the fear of all the people on board the ship. The desperation to survive. The tragedy. That’s what made Titanic move so many people and go on to win the most Oscars ever (tied with 2 other movies) including Best Picture and Director.

        The Wizard of Oz is known for being the first mainstream movie in color and its soundtrack. Do you really watch The Wizard of Oz and scream masterpiece? I don’t. Star Wars is also known for its effects and being the one time box office king, so don’t act like it’s in a different league as Titanic, and if you ask people who saw it in theaters why they were so blown away, guarantee it was the technology. The Godfather is a classic among film buffs, but not the general population who don’t visit sites like Collider.

        In fact, Wizard of Oz and Star Wars are two of the biggest pop culture movies ever. Do their writing and acting scream Oscar worthy? No. Titanic won the awards and made an impact because of it’s grand 2nd half and pulled emotion with it. Titanic deserves a place among those movies you listed. Avatar, no. I enjoyed Avatar but it wouldn’t even come close to top 10 movie of its own decade.

      • milo

        Star Wars was nominated for ten oscars including best picture, director, screenplay, and actor, and won six, plus a special award for Ben Burtt. Oz was nominated for six including best picture and won two (both for music). If it had been a couple years later or earlier it might have actually won best picture, Gone With the Wind won that year. A lot of the awards for Titanic were technical and art/costume, no wins for acting and no nomination for screenplay. Not the strongest competition that year either with As Good as it Gets and Full Monty nominated.

      • Harry

        Annie Hall wasn’t really strong competition, either.

      • milo

        Those last three have stood the test of time. Avatar isn’t nearly old enough to know if it will hold up over decades like those did. And even with Titanic, is it still as well regarded as it was when it came out? It’s hard to imagine those movies still being considered classics forty years after release. Aliens and Terminator? Those I can still see being loved decades later.

      • aceshigh

        I don’t agree…although I don’t love either Titanic or Avatar, they were both major achievements from a technical perspective. His knowledge of engineering and special effects is extremely impressive.

        He needs to return his focus more to characters and dialogue, but I stand by my “genius” claim.

      • HeSaidSheSaidMv

        There’s nothing special about Avatar’s effects at all and that’s supposed to be the best part of the movie.

      • Grimm

        True Lies really was one of his best.

      • mbmarquis69

        I enjoyed True Lies, but it’s one of his films that I almost never revisit. In many ways it doesn’t feel like a James Cameron movie (maybe that’s part of its appeal?)

        I definitely understand the love for True Lies, but I feel like some people – not necessarily you – like to call it their favorite film because it’s not the uber-popular-FX-wonderfest-money-maker that are some of his larger films.

      • Displa[er

        I’m of the mind that True Lies, if taken for what it is, stands as one of Cameron’s best. I’ll never forget the thrill as a young teenager, seeing that restroom brawl for the first time, wincing and laughing all at once. The action beats and charming leads make the movie for me, and dare I say the overall tone has a very whimsical vibe, which (again for me) makes for a fresh approach to Cameron’s patent nuts-and-bolts action virtuosity.

    • Person

      Cameron always does well with sequels, I’d give at least Avatar 2 a chance.

  • fechu1922

    make battle angel already. Stop fucking around with this eco smurf bullshit.

    • MJ

      Meh.

      Like we haven’t had enough post apocalypse cyborg action movies done over and over by now. LOL.

      • fechu1922

        avatar felt, at least for me, like a pocahontas thing with giant blue smurfs or a sci-fi colonization of the american continent. That was done by christopher columbus in 1492 so, avatar’s story, feels a lot older than any cyborg action movie. Most stories have been told before, i just enjoy cyborg actioners better and James Cameron does a great job with those.

  • Alboone

    Yeah there’s going to be a major obstacle facing these movies it’s a little something called STAR WARS. The first wise decision Cameron and Fox can make is not open these sequels during Christmas.

    • MJ

      You seem to be confused. SWE7 is opening in Dec 2015, while Avatar 2 is opening in Dec 2016. There is no release calendar conflict.

      • Johnson

        Well, there will be a Star Wars spin-off to be released December 2016 :D

      • Alboone

        Star Wars spinoff release date is Dec 16, 2016. Look it up.

      • MJ

        LOL. A spin-off. OK. I doubt Cameron is quaking in his boots over that. :-))

    • Harry

      Avatar vs. Episode 7, Cameron would be worried. Avatar vs. a Star Wars spinoff, Avatar wins at the box office.

    • Lulz
  • Steven

    Do avid Avatar fans even care about this anymore ?

    Its like the Ghostbusters updates but less funny.

    • MJ

      Yes. What I don’t care about, and what is really less funny over time, are your dumb-ass and not-in-the-slightest-bit-clever posts.

      • Steven

        Jeez, hit a nerve I see.

    • mbmarquis69

      I think so. I enjoyed Avatar, but always felt like it was a poor script. If his scripts don’t improve for the sequels, it will dampen my enthusiasm greatly.

      And as an aside, I’ve been around the Internet a long time. At least going back as far as the production of Titanic, people have been predicting James Cameron burnout/failure, and their predictions have yet to come true. As always, time will tell. But I don’t expect this talking point to go away. Whatever Cameron chooses to tackle after Avatar will be met with the same cynical predictions of burnout.

  • MJ

    “Cameron hired three writers to collaborate on each of the three upcoming sequels (Josh Friedman, Rick Jaffa & Amanda Silver and Shane Salerno)”

    Tommy, that would be “FOUR” writers then.

  • Grimm

    Lets face it. Master filmmaker he may be, great screenwriter he is not. Its encouraging hes giving writing duties to the writers so he can focus on the visuals. I enjoyed Avatar but the biggest weakness of that movie was the writing.

  • YodaRocks

    Avatar 1 was a cliched movie if you remove the 3D and CGI. I think James Cameron has lost it and whoever is backing him will make profit but not that much profit as they might be expecting.

    • DjangoBro

      Oh… Same thing could have been said for The Avengers… like whats your point? Go cry in a corner. If you don’t like it then don’t watch it loser lol

      • milo

        Avengers script is Shakespeare compared to the Avatar script. Decent characters and dialogue in addition to the action and effects.

      • DjangoBro

        Avengers is a great movie but it wasn’t anything special. Even DOFP was a better movie than The Avengers so for you to put it on some special pedestal is stupid.

  • dolphin558

    I’m excited but curious as to how the writers not know which movie was theirs until the “last day”?

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  • NICK НΛRT

    these movies are not going to make NEARLY as much money as cameron expects they will.

  • http://moviesandphilosophynow.blogspot.ca/ Vandeline

    James Cameron was responsible for two of the greatest action sequels of all time. Aliens and Terminator 2. With that alone, in spite of problems with the first film, I’m excited to see what he does with these sequels.

  • http://www.discogs.com/ AdamShitwood

    Would have rather seen him try to make sequels for Terminator. I’m certain that his vision for the war against the machines would have been epic.

  • Tyler

    The main problem with doing these sequels is whether or not the audience is going to care about Avatar anymore when he finally releases it.

  • milo

    While I’m not interested in these movies at all, it is good to hear that since they’re shooting them all back to back they’re going to have all the scripts done first. If I remember correctly, with the Pirates and Matrix sequels they shot back to back but started the second movie before the script was done on the third. And we saw how both of those turned out (I’d argue the second movies in both of those trilogies weren’t that bad, it was the third that really crashed and burned…and that could have been avoided if they had finished all the writing before starting to shoot).

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