Based ona true story, The Express follows theextraordinary life ofcollege football hero Ernie Davis (Rob Brown).
Raised in poverty in
Decorated veteran Schwartzwalder was a Southerner with a single vision of a national championship and hardened ideas about how the world worked. But though he and Davis clashed mightily, he taught the player everything he knew about football, just as
As the growing civil rights movement divided the country in the â60s,
Anyway, I recently had the chance to participate in a roundtable interview with Rob Brown and itâs below. In the film, Rob plays Ernie and itâs a solid performance from someone that clearly has a lot more going on than just his acting career.
As always, you can either read the transcript below or listen to the interview by
Question: That was a really nice performance. Congratulations.
Rob Brown: Thank you.
It must have been a very irresistible opportunity for you to play this character. Did you know much about him before you took this on?
Rob Brown: No. I knew that he went to
Did you do a lot of research?
Mostly just watching film. Game film actually, because thereâs not much medium on Ernie.
Now, you played a wide-receiver was it much of sort of head trip for you to go to wide receiver to running back?
Itâs football. At the end of the day if anything I was like a kid in a candy store because playing receiver, you know, youâre in a parameter, youâre on the outside, youâre on an island so to speak. You run a route. Youâve got to run your route. Guyâs got to protect it, got to pick up blitzes. The quarterback has to make a great throw. You catch the ball and thatâs it. You play running back, youâve got the ball in your hands for most of the time. It was a lot of fun. I kind of felt like why didnât I play running back?
There is a huge difference between playing football in real life and obviously playing footballâ¦shooting football scenes in the movie, what were the biggest challenges for you in still being adrenalin charged on film take after take after take?
No, we played. The differences were in the game today as opposed to playing ball 45 years ago. That was the difference, so a lot of guys lead with their head these days, or their chest. Back then people used their shoulder more often so Coach Allen Graf had to stress things like that. Little things like if I was to score today Iâd give my friend a high-five. This movement didnât exist back then. People didnât do this all these chest pumps and stuff so things of that nature were different. But playing itâs just football and coaches say things all the timeâ¦say things like no disrespect to Saved by the Bell but weâre not trying to make no Saved by the Bell football movie here. Weâre trying to get it cracking, so in a lot of ways we just played and we had a lot of guys who are basically division one ball players. A lot of USC guys because Coach Graf heâs an SC guy. He wears his ring all the time and his son played center. Heâs like Iâm
Did you get any real hits?
Whenever I could I tried to stick a shoulder in somebody or you know try to do something I wasnât supposed to do. I was told very early on that I couldnât take any hits because that would jeopardize the production. If I get hurt weâre messing up, so I did as much as I could and then up until they said no and then brought in one of 4 doubles I had.
How about research on Ernieâs family? Could you talk to any of Ernieâs family at all?
No. First time I met them was in
With the emotional stuff you had to do in the movie, because itâs a veryâ¦you had very emotional momentsâ¦were they more challenging for you than physical football differences as an actor?
Yeah, football is football and thatâs all fun for me. But either way I just wanted to be prepared so whenever I work I just try to be as prepared as possible, you know, even for auditions I just like to think that Iâm so prepared that I have to book it. So I treated this no different. I just wanted to be prepared every day I worked.
Ernie had a kind of father-son relationship with the coach ultimatelyâCoach Schwartzwalderâand Iâm just wondering working with Dennis on this what was your relationship like on and off the screen? How did you guys get along?
Similar because you know heâs a more tenured guy so I just try to soak up as much knowledge as possible and whenever I had a question I would just ask him and he was very responsive. In a lot of ways itâs a father-son relationship because just of where he is in his career and where Iâm at now. I have a healing blister on my thumb because he took me out with Dr. Gross and Jim Beheim to the golf course last week. You know, Iâd never played before and itâs a wrap for me now. Iâm hooked soâ¦
How did it go?
It went well for my first time, you know? I think Iâve got a knack for it. I double-boogied a hole. I had a chance for a birdie putt. It felt good, so I think Iâm going to get after it.
Give it a few more games, youâll start hating it.
All right. Iâll keep that in mind.
What do you find most inspiring about Ernieâs story?
Most inspiring to me is just his effect on people. People whoâ¦thereâs people my age in Syracuse even last weekend when we were up there, there are people my ageâIâm 24âwith anecdotes about Ernie that were passed down from their parents and so forth. And it sticks with them until this day and itâs like well, how could this guy who passed away at such a young age make such a huge impact on people? You know, I think the most inspiring thing is the fact that people look at him as such as example. They ask themselves what would Ernie do? You know those bracelets What Would Jesus Do bracelets? Now blasphemy aside, thatâs the kind of impact he had on people. People would think about things and say well what would Ernie do in this situation? I find myself doing that even up until this point I think Iâm more mature as a function of getting to know Ernie a little bit.
Is it more daunting for you as an actor to play someone who actually did exist at one time and is no longer here so that you canât really draw?
It was a gift and a curse as an artist because there was no blueprint to go off of. It was kind of a curse but it was kind of a gift because thereâs no blueprint. I can get to kind of do what I want and I have the flexibility to be an artist. So, you know, I think the thing thatâs daunting is just the responsibility associated with the role to him, his family, to Syracuse, to the Brownâs organization, to Jim Brown--definitely donât want to get him upsetâbut with that responsibility I took it on because I figured it was a dream role and it was an honor to walk in his shoes for a minute.
Did you meet Jim Brown?
Yeah, last week for the first time. I spoke to him over the phone a few times.
Was that scary?
Yeah, but I was like a kid in a candy store. I got to meet Jim Brown. So when I met him, this was right before a press conference, I kind of had to bottle up my emotions because Iâm too cool to go like ahh, Jim Brown in front of all these people at a press conference!
Now, do you look at life a little differently knowing that Ernieâs characterâhe died at the age of 23 or 24âhow does that make you look at life right now?
I turned 23 while we were shooting so I put that in proper prospective. That definitely affected how I approached things and I definitely had that life is precious approach and I needed to be dedicated and fully committed to the role, you know, keeping in mind that you know what, I could not be here right now. And that goes along with the maturity I was talking about that I gained as a result of getting to know Ernie a little bit.
What are you working on now? Do you have anything?
Nothing. Nothing.
So you didnât start anything else after you finished this?
No. After I finished this I had another semester of school to get done. So I got my degree. I walked in May so that was my next project.
Whatâs your degree in?
Master of Psychology.
Do you want to use that? You use psychology as an actor though donât you?
Yeah.
What university.
One of the most poignant scenes in the movie was the talk about the white girl talking in the movie. What was that like for you because the director spoke highly of that scene and it was the honesty that you portrayed in listening was the part to watch as opposed to the dialogue that you had between him. What was the preparation like or what was the mindset you were in in that particular scene?
Reading that screen that would definitely would strike a chord especially if youâre a black male, so Gary just stressed donât play the end of the scene at the beginning of the scene and thatâs something that if you read it itâll piss you off and I just didnât want to go in there and get there too early. And that was all. Other than that, you know, I knew what it was so I just didnât want to as Gary says play the end of the scene at the beginning of the scene.
What do you think audiences will get from this film emotionally?
At lot. What I want them to get is just general knowledge of Ernie. I just want to generate that interest of Ernie because everyone knows about Jackie Robinson. Nobody knows about Ernie. I didnât know about him and I played college football. In a lot of ways, heâs responsible for whatever success I have, you know, as a college athlete and Emerson is not the most diverse place either so I felt kind of embarrassed that I didnât know about him and I just want people to know about Ernieâs story and itâs kind of like a lost history lesson.
He wasnât able to go to certain places on campus. Did that come up inâ¦?
You know what? I doubt that because the way he looked at everythingâ¦he looked at people as if race didnât exist. He joined a Jewish fraternity. Okay, thatâs crazy especially for an African-American. Just think about it. So there was resistance definitely like there was aâ¦he got in due to a voting I guess loophole and he had to be accepted because he was just the type of guy that you couldnât deny him. You couldnât deny him like you couldnât deny him the Heisman.
What kind of perspective do you have as a young man who was born after the civil rights era and then going back and having to encounter it through the movie? Did he give you any kind perspective that you didnât have before?
Yeah and basically itâs like this. Stop whining. So things I complain about today being put in that situation on-set is like man, I really have nothing to complain about. So I just feel as though if Ernie could overcome those odds and such diversity, you know, in the late 50âs and throughout his life then I have noâI really have no excuse. I should succeed despite any adversity I face today.
He was always running to something, never from something. I think thatâs a line from the movie and thatâs great. Is that how you try to live your life?
Well, that implies a lot of ambition. I realize Iâm an ambitious guy but I just try to take things as they come, you know for the most part. I think I went after this so vehemently because I just identified with it, you know, upon reading the first 10 pages, that you know I read this script like 3 years ago and I was just on people. Whatâs going on with it? Whatâs going on with it? Whatâs going on with it? You know? And thatâs a long time to think about something and for it to come finally come into play. Thatâs huge.
Why did you decide you wanted to study psychology at college?
Well, in high school I thought I wanted to be....well just typical, you know how it is. People figure it out when they get to college. You think you want to be an astronaut and then after a while youâre a geo-major for whatever reason. Thatâs just the way it is in college. I guess thatâs what happened. I started out wanting to be an engineer and then I was taking computer-science. I figured I wanted to do that. Shut that down once I got to school. Tried econ, didnât like it. Shut that down. Then I realized all these psychology courses I really liked, so let me just stick to what Iâm drawn to.
As someone who played the game, and
Yeah definitely, but youâre not fooling anybody. Weâre at the point where if you make a sports movie you canât just cut to a ball going in or cut to somebody making a catch. You canât do that anymore because audiences arenât going to respond to that, so Iâm glad we got Coach Graf on here and he hadâ¦he talked a lot about SC, SC but Iâm glad he had those guys around there, you know to make the film look good.
I was going to ask you what did you enjoy most about making this film.
I canât pick any one thing because itâs a tough film to make. They donât make films like this all the time and the conditions in
When you were up in Syracuse, Iâm sure thereâs a lot of emotion going on the night at the premiere and people that had known him and those that had grown up admiring him in that area, was there anything or anyone in particular that came up to you that night and said something to you that just, you know, or was it just kind of the whole experience of being up there surrounded by 40,000 of his closest friends and admirers? I mean, what stands out for you about that night?
Again, nothingâ¦the whole time it was crazy. The whole time we were up there it was pretty surreal. I guess I didnât know what I was getting into. And honestly that weekend did it for me in terms of talking about how much money the film will make or whatever. That money will be spent. The film is forever and people who were around Ernie, who were close to Ernie, they think we got it right and thatâs all that really matters, so you know, Iâm satisfied. Iâm good.
Making a period piece like this, does it make you look at football today, you know, whereas you have your athletes bringing Sharpies on the field and things like that? Does it put you in a different perspective to appreciate the old game of football or does it turn you off from football the way itâs become?
No, I definitely took that mindset. You know old school coachesâ¦a lot of my coachesâ¦would say things like when you come on the field donât walkârun. And thatâs the mindset I kind of took because itâs Ernie Davis. You canât just be slapping around with your helmet off on the fieldâ¦thatâs another thingâdonât take your helmet off on the field. I donât know if anyoneâs from Cleveland but Dwayne Rudd did that a couple of years agoâlost the game. He was celebrating, took his helmet off, you know thatâs just disrespect. Itâs a rule thatâs in the rule book but no one calls it became itâs just like you just donât do that. So I kind of looked at the overall culture of the sport and I really wanted to respect it as Ernie did, down to shoelaces being tied. My doubles were sagging something, hey man tuck that in. You know, donât disrespect the game.
Wasnât there so issue with his statue at
Yeah. It was bad. I watched Jim Romeâ¦you know that show Jim Rome is Burning? Anyone know? I watch that show religiously so I was like ironing a shirt and his final burn was about thatâ¦the statute of limitations. I was like oh man. But itâll get corrected. People make mistakes. Itâs a bad mistake to make but itâll get corrected.
But back to psychology for a moment. What are you going to do with the degree?
Iâm not sure. Iâm not fresh out but I havenât just had any free time in a long time. Iâve either been in school or working for so long that Iâm just going to kind of let it breathe. I might get my Masterâs in Social Work. I donât know. I really donât know. Iâm just taking life as it comes to me.
Is this like a backup in case you decide you donât want to act anymore or do you want to do something else besides acting?
Itâs not a backup. Itâs just something Iâm interested in doing. My motherâs a social worker as well so I really admire how she serves her community. She works with a lot of people with the virus and substance abuse people as well, so I look at that I see a lot of good that she does and I figure, you know what, I can definitely use my celebrity to the extent that I can give back to my community and on top of that if I had my Masterâs people really canât tell me nothing, soâ¦
You can use it to get into the heads of your characters canât you if you know psychâ¦?
Yeah, definitely. Yeah.
There you go.
Thatâs really what it is. Dealing with the crazies in
Have you given any thought to doing theatre? Charles Dutton thought that youâd be great on the boards?
Yeah, you know what? Iâm not opposed to anything. If an opportunity comes across Iâll answer the door if it comes knocking.