Filmmaker Robert Kenner explores the perils of global warming in a highly entertaining and satirical way in his latest documentary, Merchants of Doubt, inspired by the 2010 book by Naomi Oreskes and Erik Conway. Using magic and sleight-of-hand as visual metaphors, he exposes the techniques of media showmen who make a lucrative living manufacturing doubt and confusion by conjuring up scientific controversies where none exist. Hired by profitable industries to promote a well-funded campaign of deception, these so-called experts use clever artifice to distort the facts and manipulate the public into disregarding the hard science behind relevant issues.

In an exclusive interview, Kenner discussed why he chose this project as the follow-up to his Academy Award-nominated Food, Inc., how a small group of pundits-for-hire have been remarkably effective at challenging the public’s perception and ability to tackle serious questions, the similarities between today’s climate change debate and past controversies involving the tobacco, chemical and food industries, how deceptive tactics have evolved over time, why character assassination is so effective, how he set out to make a fun and compelling film, his most shocking interview, why the media has a responsibility to start calling these spinmeisters out, and his upcoming documentary Command and Control.

How did this project first come together for you?

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ROBERT KENNER: One of the things that helped inspire me was that when I was making Food, Inc., I went to a hearing on whether we should label cloned meat. I couldn’t believe there was such a thing as cloned meat. While I was there, the thing that really shocked me was there was a representative from the meat industry who stood up and said, “We really don’t think it’s in the interest of the public to give them this kind of information.” I thought, “Whoa! Who’s saying such a thing and why is it not in our interest?” I looked into it. There were groups that are funded by fast food and by certain companies.

There was a group called Citizens for Consumer Freedom that would do everything to stop labeling of any product, and I thought, “That is bizarre.  It’s so Orwellian.” There turned out to be one Orwellian name after another. I’m not surprised that there are people who are out to confuse people, but I was shocked at the lengths that they would go to create that confusion. These names were just bizarre. So that was the beginning of thinking this is something. In a way, Merchants of Doubt is really a continuation of Food, Inc. about how we’re being denied access to information that can affect our lives tremendously and how this small group of talented people learned their skill from the tobacco industry that spent fifty years creating doubt around a product where there was no doubt. That’s pretty impressive skill to be able to do.

How have deceptive tactics evolved since then for deniers in today’s media environment?

KENNER: On some levels, I don’t think they’ve changed that tremendously. Again, it’s that doubt factor. How do you create it? I think that it’s the same tactics that were used for tobacco when there were laws saying you can’t smoke in restaurants and tobacco companies decided [otherwise]. They didn’t say, “Hey, we should be allowed to. It’s not bad for us.” But they knew it was bad for us. They started to say, “Hey, we’re being denied our freedom.” And those are the same tactics. So there are these key words. I think the difference today from fifty years ago is that there are fewer and fewer investigative journalists that exist out there. Certainly, in the science realm, they’re slashing jobs right and left. Many of those same journalists now go off and work as PR reps for the very corporations they used to be investigating.

I thought your storytelling approach and cinematic style made the film fun and compelling.  What were some of the challenges of crafting an entertaining film that deals with an overwhelming topic?

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KENNER: (Laughs) It keeps you up at night. It’s hard. I was inspired by the film Thank You for Smoking. I thought they did an incredible job. In the midst of making this film, I kept getting more and more interested in the actual people who create the doubt. It’s much more interesting than any other aspect of the story. And then, the metaphor of using magic took over. I kept searching for how to use the humor of the deniers in some ways. In a funny way, Marc Morano (Executive Director of ClimateDepot.com, a leading site for climate change skeptics) helped influence the style of the film as much as Naomi Oreskes. He certainly influenced the style more. Obviously, I don’t agree with him on what he’s doing, but I’m impressed by how they’re able to both be funny and succinct. We were aiming to try to make a film that’s entertaining and at the same time is tackling really serious questions.

I enjoyed what magician Jamy Ian Swiss and the Skeptic’s Society brought to the proceedings. Can you talk about that approach and using magic as a metaphor?

KENNER: I wanted to parallel the Three-card Monte scene. I think it was Glenn Beck who says to Steve Moyer, “Are you in bed with big oil. And if so, how good are you in bed?” And he goes, “Oh no, I’m just trying to do the right thing.” The fact is he’s being paid a fortune by these companies. And then, you cut to the Three-card Monte scene, and as Jamy said, it’s not just how quick you move your hand, but it takes a confidence man, an independent voice saying, “I’m trying to do the right thing.” You see that confidence man getting paid off. So it makes you think, “Hey, I can win, too.” It’s the parallel that Steve’s saying, “Hey, I’m just trying to help you out. I’m trying to tell you what I see.” But he’s hiding the fact that he’s being paid to say this. So, the parallel of seeing how magic works and at the same time seeing how deception works in whatever field it is, whether it’s cigarettes or pharmaceuticals or climate change, it’s really not that different than the magic itself.

How do you strike the right balance in a film about deception and how it’s being used in the media and present illuminating viewpoints from both sides – the working scientists and the clever pundits whose agenda contradicts the facts?

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KENNER: In a funny way, what interests me is the way the media misinterpreted this situation. The scientists who are working 80 hours a week trying to do their science are up against PR guys who know how to spin things and how to create doubt. Creating doubt around tobacco for fifty years when they absolutely knew it caused cancer, that was a real talent. But meanwhile, the scientists, they’re not there to go on television. Their brains don’t work like that. The fact that the media took Marc Morano, who said, “I play a scientist on television,” and who’s really quick and really funny, and put him up against, as Marc says, boring scientists, makes it an unfair fight. It’s the job of the media to represent that these guys are not scientists. They’re paid industrial PR hacks in effect. They’re looking to defend and create doubt around whatever they’re being paid for.

What was your most memorable interview?  Also, was it hard to get these people to let you into their world?

KENNER: One interview that didn’t come out and didn’t go on film was with Peter Sparber (a former Tobacco Institute executive). I’ll give you two answers to this one. Peter Sparber was the guy who masterfully deflected the fact that it wasn’t cigarettes that caused house fires, but it was couches that caused house fires, which is an act of genius. And then, the answer was that he got it made into a law that we have to put chemicals in these couches that turned out not to prevent fires and caused cancer. That takes a brilliant mind to do such evil work. Peter returned my call and we talked about his memo that said, “If you can do tobacco, you can do anything.” I said, “I’d love you to be in the film. You’re so good at what you do. It’s not only tobacco. It goes into multiple subjects and one of these being climate.” He said, “You could take Jim Hansen and I could take a garbage man, and I could get America to believe the garbage man knows more about science than Jim Hansen does.” I thought that’s pretty frickin’ wild. I said, “That’s why I’d love to have you in the film.” That’s one we didn’t get. He said to me, “I know you can make a good movie without me, and I know I can lead a good life without you. Let’s talk tomorrow.” And I never heard from him again.

Obviously, the most shocking interview was Marc Morano because he was so honest and told me how he did things. He was both thoroughly enjoyable and thoroughly entertaining, but on some levels kind of horrifying. But I was very appreciative of Marc for telling me how he does what he does. I loved his line, by the way, when he was talking about the IPCB (Illinois Pollution Control Board), and he said, “Think of the EPA but they speak French.” He’s very funny.

Why is character assassination such an effective tool in their arsenal?

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KENNER: Hopefully it doesn’t continue. Again, I think it’s collecting attention. If you question the messenger, it distracts from the message. But it’s amazing to me to think that these scientists become questioned. Stan Glantz (Professor, UCSF School of Medicine), the  tobacco expert at the beginning of the film, says to his students, “If you’re going to be a scientist, get ready to be attacked. There’s a good chance if you come across something that’s inconvenient to an industry, you’re going to become a target. It comes with the territory.” I think it’s sad that scientists who are thoroughly unprepared for this become those targets. They really were thoroughly confused by these attacks. They had no clue what they were about. It was really confusing. The idea that these people were being call communists, they didn’t have a clue what that was about. It’s just off the wall. They were doing their work in a vacuum.

So, it’s not their job. I think it’s the media’s job. If there’s anything we want to really get at in this film, it’s that the media has to start calling these people out. It’s about this false balance situation that the Earth is round and the Earth is flat. We need both sides when there weren’t both sides. There are both sides to what are we going to do about it, but they’re not both sides to the science.

What are your thoughts on the moral problems and legacy of failed leadership that we seem to be leaving to future generations?

KENNER: There are so many problems in the world that it’s hard to figure out which one to tackle. You want to tackle the more immediate ones. I think Merchants of Doubt is more about deception than it is about any specific problem.  But the irony is that these merchants are able to ultimately put into question our ability to think about issues where we could help, which really creates disastrous effects for the planet.  And yet, they still make an oil company a little more money for the next few years.  It’s a bit shortsighted. It’s a little like Jack Benny, the comedian, used to say when he was held up at gunpoint and the robber said, “Your money or your life.” And he said, “Give me two minutes to think about it.” I think that’s in a way where the energy companies are at, that they’re ready to take the oil out. They can’t leave the oil in the ground. It’s frightening. It’s a really difficult subject to deal with and that’s why we decided to go at it by talking about it being about doubt, denial and deception, and hopefully making people upset they’re being lied to.

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The story just broke this weekend about Dr. Wei-hock Soon (a scientist at the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics), one of the few real scientists who was questioning climate [change], who it turned out was being paid millions of dollars by the oil companies. It was something that was probably known for a while, but he was being paid, and he would say, “What are my deliverables?” And he would talk about how much he was getting for it. So, it was a direct payment from the oil companies or the coal companies. Southern Company was paying him. And then, he was also getting direct payments, deliverables, to go testify in front of Congress for Jim Hansen who’s getting the most money from any oil company. This is one of the four or five scientists that is talking about it. It’s frightening that these guys are getting almost equal coverage in the press when it shouldn’t be that way.

What did you learn about yourself in the process of making this and how did the final film compare to what you originally envisioned?

KENNER: It was a hard movie to make because I was totally wanting to have fun at being serious so it’s a funny line to walk. One thing that happened was I was interviewing George Shultz who was Reagan’s Secretary of State who has solar panels and drives an electric car. He saw my car and he said, “What are you? An idiot?” because I drive a gas car. Trying to change was hard. If I weren’t making the movie, I’m not sure I would have changed, but I ended up changing and I’m really happy for it. I’m almost down to zero consumption on my electrical bill. So I feel better for that. Ultimately, unlike food, it’s a harder issue because we need to pay the real cost of this energy. When we’re paying the real cost, it will be easier to make those changes. But ultimately, also, it’s really a film about deception and hopefully people don’t want to be lied to.

What are you working on next that you’re excited for audiences to know about?

KENNER: I’m working on a new documentary called Command and Control based on Eric Schlosser’s bestseller. Schlosser, who wrote Fast Food Nation, wrote a book called Command and Control: Nuclear Weapons, the Damascus Accident, and the Illusion of Safety. It’s about a person who drops a tool [that punctured the missile] in a hydrogen missile silo in 1980 and almost sets off a warhead that was equal to all the weapons used in World War II including Hiroshima and Nagasaki times three. It’s a thriller, six hours of waiting to see what would happen. It turns out it was the second worst accident that week.

Merchants of Doubt opens on March 6th in LA/NY.

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