Multihyphenate Kirk Thatcher has been involved with a vast range of iconic movies and television over the past 40 years. From his first job, on Star Wars: Return of the Jedi no less, Thatcher has been crafting beloved stories that reach into all corners of fandom as a writer, director, producer, actor, and visual effects coordinator. Though much of his career centers around his work with Jim Henson on the Muppets franchise, Thatcher has also worked on projects like Star Trek, Gremlins, Spiderman: Homecoming, and many more. Recently Collider's own Editor-in-Chief, Steve Weintraub sat down with Thatcher to discuss his work on the highly acclaimed smash hit MCU television special, Werewolf by Night.
During their conversation, Weintraub made sure to get the scoop from Thatcher on his work on Star Trek, particularly Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home. Having hit theaters in 1986, Star Trek IV, a.k.a. the one with the whales, is widely beloved and considered one of the best feature films in the franchise. The movie sees Captain Kirk (William Shatner), Spock (Leonard Nimoy), and the whole Enterprise crew on a mission to the past — San Francisco, 1986, to be exact — to prevent a future catastrophe. Thatcher served as an associate producer and also had a cameo in the movie as the now iconic "punk on the bus." Thatcher recently made a cameo, reprising his role as "the punk on the bus" in Season 2 of Star Trek: Picard which also heavily featured time travel to prevent a future disaster.
One of the reasons Star Trek IV is so beloved is that it's almost a romantic comedy wrapped up in a Star Trek movie. Weintraub asked Thatcher if he had any idea the movie would be such a hit while they were making it, and while he was quick to say "well, you never know," Thatcher pointed out that he was drawn to the same thing that has given the movie such staying power, its comedy. "What I liked about it was the humor," Thatcher told Collider. "I loved Star Trek growing up. I was a huge Trek fan, and I liked the fun between the characters." Thatcher continued:
"I knew it was special and that it was fun. But you never know, I didn't know that the punk was going to haunt me for the rest of my life. I mean, it was a fun little gag. It was more like an Easter egg, like, "Oh, that was associate producer." It wasn't like, 'This is going to be this huge moment.'"
Kirk Thatcher On Working With Leonard Nimoy and Star Trek IV's VFX
In discussing Star Trek IV, Thatcher explained that when he was hired by Leonard Nimoy, he was brought on to make sure the effects were good so that Nimoy could focus on the story. As Thatcher put it:
"He said, 'I want you to deal with all the technical stuff with effects and sets, and all that, because I want to focus on the story.' He said the thing that made Star Trek resonate, in his mind, was the relationship between Kirk, Spock, and Bones — and the other characters — but that triumvirate, which was not revelatory at that point, but he said, 'I want to focus on those relationships, and I want the effects, and I want it to look good, but I don't want to have to worry about that. So that's why you're here.' I got all this responsibility to make decisions on stuff as long as he approved it. Because he really wanted to focus on telling that story. It was an amazing job, and he gave me a lot of freedom to do that."
As he continued on Thatcher explained that Nimoy knew early on that this was not like the Star Trek movies they'd made so far. "I think Leonard knew that it was going to be different. I think he knew that II was for the Trek fans, diehard sci-fi fans. III was kind of him cutting his teeth, and it had a classic bad guy." He went on to say, "I was on a panel with [Nick Meyer] about Star Trek IV, and he said, 'It's the only Star Trek that doesn't have a villain,' a Star Trek movie. I mean, you could say a V`ger's the villain in the first one, but there's no bad guy. The bad guy is human ignorance, and so it was very Star Trek in that way."
Thatcher went on to say that working on Star Trek was an "amazing job," particularly thanks to the faith Nimoy had in him at such a young age. He explains that he got to do a little bit of everything while working on Star Trek IV:
"I got to write dialogue and got to play the punk, and did a computer voice, the computer at the beginning where it says, 'Logic is the cement of our civilization with which we ascend from chaos using reason as our guide.' That's me and I wrote those questions. I was 23, and the fact that Leonard just gave me this sort of carte blanche to do stuff. He knew I was a science nerd, and Harve Bennett, too, was the producer, and the writer of all the Star Trek-era or the 23rd Century stuff. They just were like, 'Hey, do you want to do this because it's just gobbledygook, but it has to be Star Trek.' I'm like, 'Sure.'
I know, it's kind of amazing. I don't know what star I was born under, or what pheromones my brain, my head, gives off, but they were trusting me. They trusted me way more than the studios do now, I will say. You work for Disney, they're so all over you about everything and I'm like, 'God, I was spoiled with Jim Henson.'"
You Don't Have to be a Star Trek Fan to Enjoy The Voyage Home
Star Trek IV serves as an excellent entry point for the now massive Star Trek franchise because "you didn't have to be a Star Trek fan" to enjoy it and that's what makes it such a successful movie. Thatcher explained:
"You could have just a tertiary knowledge of like, "'Oh, Kirk and Spock, and they're in space,' and still enjoy the movie. Whereas Khan, Wrath of Khan II, which is a great Star Trek movie, [but] if you don't know who that is, you're like, 'Why is this guy with his shirt open yelling and so over the top?' And I think that was it. It was a great movie, not just a great Star Trek movie."
Another boon to the movie's success is the fact that the characters are sent back in time. Most of the Star Trek timeline is set in the future, with the Vulcans not making first contact on Earth until 2063, and the events of The Original Series taking place another 200 years after that. But Star Trek IV sends Captian Kirk and company back to 1986, which is a little more fathomable for a wider audience. As Thatcher put it, the time travel elements of Star Trek IV made it more "relatable." He said:
" The time travel element, going back to the time that it was filmed in, really helps because, again, that made it relatable. 'Oh, they're in today, there's a punk.' It was much more relatable, and there's a sea park and all the things we have in our world. But the sense of humor, Nick Meyer is very dry, cutting, like, 'Judging by the pollution and content of the atmosphere, I believe we have landed somewhere in the latter half of the 20-' Just these little digs at our society, I think made it super popular. While we were filming it, I don't think anyone knew this was going to be the breakout movie. I just thought they thought this is a fun movie with great character stuff in it."
The Staying Power of Star Trek IV's Comedy
During their conversation Weintraub pointed out that it's the little moments of Star Trek IV also add to the film's staying power, making it such a beloved movie among Star Trek and sci-fi fans. Thatcher revealed that the particular joke they're discussing — a moment when Scotty tries to talk to an Apple computer because that's how you interface with a computer on the Enterprise — is one that he contributed to the film. As he puts it:
"I wrote that gag, that he talks to the mouse, because I had just gotten an Apple 512 Mac, and so the whole thing was, they said, 'Well we're going to have the design thing done on a Macintosh because it's a graphic computer.' I said, 'Well, then Scotty should sit down,' — because I'm a Trek fan — I said, 'He should talk to the computer because he doesn't know. He'd just be like, 'Hello computer,' it doesn't do anything.' And then Alex Henteloff goes, 'Well use the mouse.' So he thinks it's a microphone because they look like a microphone. So that was my gag that got in the movie, and Leonard loved it."
Werewolf by Night is available to stream on Disney+. You can watch Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home right now on Paramount+ and check out the trailer down below.