After three weeks of rave reviews in selected cities like New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Boston, Dallas and Phoenix, Win Win expanded to a host of new cities this weekend. It paid off with $5,398 per theater, (in the top 5 averages over the past 3 days) and $1.22 million overall. Weâve spread out our interviews with the filmâs Oscar-nominated stars Paul Giamatti, Amy Ryan and newcomer Alex Shaffer through the platform release because highly praised independent films which actually exceed that hype are rare and deserve all the extended support that sites like the one youâre reading can provide.That brings us to our fourth installment: an interview with the filmâs Oscar-nominated filmmaker Tom McCarthy (The Station Agent, The Visitor and Up).  For a writer, director and actor who is so meticulous about his work on both sides of the camera, he was surprisingly open about his process in all three disciplines. Hit the jump for the interviewâs audio and transcript, including a look inside Pixar, the latest on The Million Dollar Arm, how Patricia Clarkson one-upped him on The Station Agent and his memories of an indie film trailblazer. Continued after the jump.Win Win is centered on Mike Flaherty (played by Paul Giamatti), a small-time attorney and volunteer high school wrestling coach who is metaphorically and, at one point, literally pinned by his own issues.  Early in the film, a local court is about to move his elderly client (Burt Young) to a rest home when Flaherty successfully pleads with the judge to give him custody, instead.  In a scam pulled out of financial desperation, Mike still puts the man in the home and assumes collection of a monthly guardian stipend.  The plan backfires when his clientâs grandson runs away from home to live with him. Without viable alternatives, Flaherty takes the boy in. The teen and his impressive wrestling ability help Mike and his winless team in countless ways.More than 25 years before Win Winâs release, McCarthy was on the New Providence High School wrestling squad in New Jersey. He developed the film with former teammate Joe Tiboni who, like the main character, is an elder law attorney.  They used stories from his legal experiences and their wrestling background, but the story is far from autobiographical.After high school, McCarthy grappled with his future at Boston College. As one of five kids in a family that pursued business, he began in the School of Management. An accounting professor, Robert M. Turner, realized it wasnât a great fit and urged him to switch majors.  He immediately shifted to Philosophy, but really wanted to act.  McCarthy loved his time with BCâs comedy improv troupe, My Motherâs Fleabag alongside talent like Nancy Walls (who later became a regular on Saturday Night Live and The Daily Show where she worked with her husband, Steve Carell). His work with the group also foretold a future career in production as he discovered the need to create his own artistic opportunities.Fleabag wanted to stick together after graduation, but with a desire to leave Boston, avoid the high costs of NY and sidestep the thick concentration of improv comedy in Chicago, they settled on Minneapolis. The group, re-named Every Motherâs Nightmare, split up after about a year and McCarthy pursued more dramatic theater in Chicago before he moved back East. At age 24, he enrolled in the Yale School of Drama, where he became classmates with future Win Win star Paul Giamatti and joined the Yale Cabaret, which had been a creative home to prior grads Henry Winkler (Class of â70), Meryl Streep (â75), Angela Bassett (â83) and Patricia Clarkson (â85).He also excelled in school as a writer/director and won a 1995 Fox Fellowship with his classmate Trevor Anthony to write and produce a play.  They premiered a work about P.T. Barnum called The Killing Act in 1995 at the Access Theater in Tribeca with Peter Dinklage as a manic Tom Thumb. McCarthy was impressed by Dinklageâs performance and intrigued by the way others interacted with the 4â5â actor. After several years of development, he wrote and directed his first feature film, The Station Agent, specifically suited to Dinklage. It focused on a loner (Dinklage) who very reluctantly opens up to a unique new group of friends when he inherits an abandoned train depot. The film was a sleeper hit at the 2003 Sundance Film Festival and McCarthyâs screenplay won a slew of honors, including a BAFTA and Independent Spirit Award.Across the country at Pixar Animation Studios, Monsters Inc. director Pete Docter, a big fan of The Station Agent, was struggling with the plot of his new film about a lonely 78-year-old retired balloon salesman who sets off on a wild adventure after his wife dies. The characterâs main companions were a flightless bird and a talking dog but Docter feared children wouldnât relate to a protagonist who is so much older than them. Pixarâs team referenced The Station Agent as they worked out the structure for their project and even had McCarthy screen his film and talk about it with them. When his co-director Bob Peterson took a break to work on Ratatouille, Docter called McCarthy seeking recommendations for writers when Tom asked, âHow about me?â Having expertly woven eccentric supporting characters (played by Patricia Clarkson, Michelle Williams and Bobby Cannavale) in The Station Agent around a lead (Dinklage) who, like Upâs Carl Fredericksen, is fully committed to isolation, McCarthy was on familiar ground. He came on board for 3-4 months and suggested a child (who became the filmâs 8-year-old boy scout Russell) should tag along because it would allow an emotional entry point for the audience and force Carl out of his comfort zone. Additionally, as they fleshed out Fredricksenâs legal problems for the early scenes of Up, McCarthy called his buddy who specialized in elder law and would become his Win Win co-writer, Joe Tiboni. McCarthyâs contributions were a huge hit and so was the film. Up drew in more than $731 million of worldwide box office, won the Academy Award for Best Animated Feature and landed a Best Original Screenplay Oscar nomination, for him, Docter and Peterson.McCarthy found a work ethic similar to his own at the studio, with the extreme attention to detail.  Four years passed between each of his three directorial efforts. However, as an illustration of Pixarâs lengthy production process, when McCarthy finished his writing assignment, he wrote, directed and released his next film, The Visitor, two years before Upâs 2009 world premiere at Cannes.The Visitor focuses on a lonely college professor (played by Richard Jenkins) who returns to New York City for a conference and finds his rarely used apartment is inhabited by a young couple of illegal immigrants through a surreptitious sublet. The three work through the situation, before the plot takes a surprising turn. The film debuted to critical acclaim at the Toronto and Sundance Film Festivals. Plenty of honors followed; McCarthy won an Indie Spirit Award for Best Director, while Jenkins received an Oscar nomination for Best Actor.It should be noted that McCarthyâs career behind the camera didnât come because of a lack of work in front of it. He has worked steadily on stage, television and film since his graduation from Yale. He was on Broadway in the 2002 Tony-nominated revival of Noises Off and joined the casts of buzz-worthy shows like Boston Public and The Wire. The 45-year-old also landed roles in indie films (Year Of The Dog and Mammoth) and a variety of high-profile genre pictures ranging from: comedy (Meet The Parents and Baby Mama) to action (2012), thriller (Syriana) and historical drama (Good Night, and Good Luck and Flags of Our Fathers).We started our conversation about his latest effort as a writer/director, Win Win, with talk of that acting work. The film won over audiences at its Sundance premiere and is one of the yearâs best-reviewed films partially due to its subtlety. We wondered about the times when heâs found himself on set, as an actor, with a script that is over-written. You can click here for the audio, which we highly recommend, as always or read on for the transcript.-Collider: Part of the beauty of the film is its subtlety. How often are you in films where you think, âOh my God, if (the writer) had just pulled this backâ¦âTom McCarthy: Yeah, itâs a good question. I think actors do have pretty good instincts about that. First of all, as an actor, a lot of times, when Iâm IN a scene, youâre trying not to over-think it. Youâre just trying to really be in the moment and commit to it, because if you start to do that, you just sabotage yourself. So, I donât do that a lot. That doesnât mean when Iâm reading the script, Iâm not like, âHuh.  I wonder how this is gonna work and you know, Iâve had the good fortune of working with some really good directors, lately [Doug Liman, Oscar winner Peter Jackson and Oscar nominees Paul Weitz and Tony Gilroy] and I try not to second-guess them. You know, I try to think, âWell, they certainly had a vision for this and, you know, youâre always pleasantly surprised, you know, when youâre working on something.  Youâre like, âIs this gonna work? And then it does and youâre like, âWow! Look what they did.â Because I only saw my piece of it, you know, and I think, that certainly as a director, I understand, thereâs a lot more to see. But, that said, sometimes youâre in a scene and you feel that and itâs really just as simple (as asking the writer), âShould I say that? Donât we know that, kind of?â And, you know, (a) good writer reacts like, âYeah, you might be right. Letâs hear it. What do you think? I think we get it (without the dialogue). We can play it. Great. Letâs fix it.âLike the Steve McQueen story of when he slashed a full page of dialogue and went, âI can do that with a âyeah.ââMcCarthy: (Laughs) Yeah. Exactly. And sometimes thatâs true. And unfortunately, sometimes you have directors or writers who are like, (panicked) âNo, no. Iâve really thought about that and itâs really good and...â And (as actors) weâre like, âYeah, we know. Everything youâre saying makes sense, but this is the next stage of development.â And, look, I, as a writer-director, I sort of have a policy. Iâm like, âCommit to whatâs there and then weâll know (if it works).â I think the problem is, sometimes, actors want to skip that stage and just say, âWell, I know.â Well, then thereâs no discovery here. You know, so letâs commit and letâs try it and if not, weâll try something else. And that is about process and, and that, for me, all comes back to trust. You know, if you have the trust of your actors, you know youâre on the same page of good, open communication with them, you can achieve a lot more. When that starts to break down? (When) thereâs a lack of trust or a lack of communication, thatâs when things can get a little bit wonky on set.Yeah. Is that something that youâve come to over time?  Because a lot of writer-directors are so protective of their dialogue, I know (The) Station Agent was such a collaborative process with [the filmâs star] Peter [Dinklage] years before you even started (filming).McCarthy: I think it is, but I think (I) came to it before as an actor and doing a lot of independent films with first-time writer-directors and they were just so, like âYeah, thatâs good, thatâs good. Hereâs how (you should do it).â Itâs like when youâre having a discussion and, and youâre making a point. Someoneâs like âRight. Right. Right. Well, let me just say, let me just s-â¦â And youâre just like, âOk, but you DIDNâT even let in what I said. Thereâs no WAY you couldâve because I havenât finished my point and youâre coming in.â Itâs still a lesson I had to learn. I remember (working) with (Oscar nominee Patricia) Clarkson on The Station Agent and there was a moment. It was actually not dialogue, but it was an action: she picks up her purse and walks quickly to the door. Patty did it and, like, sauntered. (McCarthy quickly looks down at stage directions on his pantomimed screenplay in hand and mutters) âThatâs not a âquickly,â thatâs reallyâ¦â but it was so deliberate and right and I realized she was playing it like, (recalling it with a laugh) âOh, Iâm gonna re-gain my composure.â Itâs like a drunk person not playing drunk. It was genius and I was like, (looking back at the pantomimed screenplay, he begrudgingly mutters) âThatâs pretty good. Thatâs better than what I wrote. Iâm gonna change that for the production scriptâ but I didnât have that in me. I wasnât gonna be like, âWow! Thatâs great.â I was like, âHuh.â And I had to trust it and I asked her about it and she (responded) âLetâs go with it.â It was the right move. You know? And, so, I think, sometimes, there is that, hopefully, that sense of discovery. Now, you donât always have the time for that and I think good actors commit and I was fortunate with these actors that they did that, and then there were times where we just found things. Sometimes, just being on location dictates that.Yeah. You (have) worked in so many different (capacities on set from actor to writer to director on) so many different kinds of films. I mean, 2012.  You donât really get a bigger film than 2012.McCarthy: No bigger film.(Yet) your three features [The Station Agent, The Visitor and Win Win] are-McCarthy: (Deadpan)  Epic. Pretty big, right? (Laughs)Well, theyâre big in emotion, but theyâre very personal stories.McCarthy: Yeah.Would you ever branch out, in terms of doing a big screen epic like (2012, a) huge blockbuster?McCarthy: Look, I, I would never say never to anything, because itâs all about where you are in the time and what youâre connecting to. If suddenly, I thought, âOh my G-d. I totally have an in on this movie (to make it emotionally accessible) or I have a connection to it or I have an idea or a vision for it, then yeah. But I think it has to be something that you connect with. Otherwise, itâs just doing it to be a big, blockbuster director. You work with Roland Emmerich (2012) once and you know these are the movies he loves to make. His enthusiasm and his passion for those projects is limitless. He loves doing it and heâs very good at it. He really understands that genre of movie and you sense it when youâre working with him. You know, like, Iâm in good hands. He knows what heâs doing.  Itâs all about challenges. Once you get to the place where youâre like, âOh, I can generate my own work,â there (are) not a lot of people who can do that. I think when youâre in that position, itâs gotta be about, âWhatâs the challenge here? Whatâs exciting about this?âYeah.McCarthy: âHow do I not get bored?â And Iâve talked to like, colleagues of mine, other directors who are like, Iâm kind of bored with this type of storytelling. I donât know how to shake it upâ and thatâs not just, âOh, I need to shake it up to shake it up.â  Itâs, âFind that, that passion I had in the 1st movie, the 2nd movie, the 3rd movie. How do I do that? How do I, you know, re-connect to the material in that way.â So, I think thatâs really interesting, actually.How much of your process changed in working on Up because I know you were credited with-McCarthy: Yeah.bringing the kid (Russell) in, because before that, it was a,-McCarthy: (Smiling) Just this old- -a very different story.McCarthy: -old boring man. Yeah, you know, I think Up was a great example because for people who make such big movies, you meet (the creative teams at Pixar) and theyâre all just like, little tinkerers. They donât work in an epic scale. They work, like, in (tiny), theyâre so specific and theyâre all about story, theyâre all about development.Well, thatâs actually why I ask you about doing a blockbuster because Up really is a very intimate, personal story-McCarthy: Right.-that if made as a live action independent film,-McCarthy: Youâre right.-could very well be, you know, (The) Station Agent, could very well be-McCarthy: Right.-an assembled family, you know, and, and yes, I know you brought that to it, in terms of the assembled family, but-McCarthy: But how many big blockbusters do you see like that? And I think thatâs what makes them such a utopian place to develop those types of stories is that they foster it. They demand it. Theyâre like, (banging on the table in front him to emphasize the point) âWhy? How? Go deeper! Challenge it. Go deeper! You donât hear that from a lot of studio execs making live action epics. Theyâre like, âI donât care. Make it bigger. Thatâs all I care aboutâ or- Pixar, the reason their movies make a lot of money, are blockbusters, but are also SO critically acclaimed is because they HAVE that attention to detail. They care. (John) Lasseter is their guy! I mean, think about that! Itâs like; John Lasseter is your studio head. Ok, big advantage! You know? Like, youâre starting there! When youâre pitching a movie, youâre pitching it to Lasseter! And heâll ask you a question like, âYeah? HOW do they land on a cloud? Explain THAT to me!â And youâre like, âOk. All right. Well? Hereâs how they do it. â And heâs like, âHmmm.â  Being there, youâre like, âAw, THIS is inspiring, âcause all theyâre doing is challenging each other to tell the BEST story they can. Theyâre NOT challenging themselves to make a blockbuster. And to push the limits of what theyâve done before and, and you canât help but feel that when youâre there. And it feels so obvious but itâs so hard to replicate. I mean, thereâs a reason they are the most successful movie studio ever.Do you have enough of a technical skill now with illustration to [direct] something like that?McCarthy: (Laughs) Negative. No. No. I understand the process a little bit more, but theyâre all different, varying degrees. You know like, Pete Docter [Director of Up, Monsters, Inc. & the upcoming Monsters, Inc 2] happens to be an amazing animator. He came up through the ranks of anim-, and [Wall-E director Andrew] Stanton is more story, you know?Yeah.Stantonâs more of a pure writer. Mmhmm.McCarthy: Docterâs not and they all have their different strengths in that kind of collective, in those top 3 or 4 or 5 guys at Pixar. Do I understand the process a lot more? Yeah. Would I be interested in jumping back in? Yeah, if it was with the right team again, you know, and Pete (Docter) and I have, kind of, bandied about ideas. Weâve just both been busy on our own thing and-Would they be a sequel to Up?McCarthy: No. Weâve never talked about that. I think Upâs Up.No, I know, itâs a stand-alone [film], but- McCarthy: Yeah. No, weâve talked about our different new ideas and we have a few. We just havenât had time. Weâve just both been busy. Yeah. McCarthy: Weâre both on opposite coasts and- What are some of those ideas that youâve talked-McCarthy: Oh, no WAY can I talk about those ideas. (Both smile & laugh) So, [The] Million Dollar Arm. How far along is that?[Ed. Note: Disney just signed McCarthy to adapt the true story of sports agent J.B. Bernsteinâs quest to find pitching prospects in India.  Spoiler Alerts: He noticed the arm motion of cricket bowlers was similar to baseball pitchers and created a 2008 reality competition called âThe Million Dollar Armâ which discovered two prospects, Rinku Singh and Dinesh Patel, who had never played baseball. They underwent intense training to learn the game and were eventually signed by the Pittsburgh Pirates. The two reportedly learned English through a variety of means, which include rap music, ESPNâs Baseball Tonight and American action films. According to the Piratesâ minor league website, Singh is still with the teamâs Class-A minor league club State College (PA) Spikes in the New York-Penn League. Patel was let go by the Piratesâ Rookie Gulf Coast League team last November]McCarthy: Iâm just starting it. Iâll do a writing job once a year, when I find something that I think is really interesting. And, you know, itâs a way for me to pay the bills and hopefully, come up with a good script and something about this story I just found really interesting. (Youâre) just 100% writing it (and not directing it)?McCarthy: Uh, Iâm not at, you know, weâll see how it, how it turns out. You know, itâs a great way of vetting the people youâre working with, too, is you collaborate in developing the script and then, if theyâre interested in me directing it and Iâm interested in directing it, then we can have that conversation which weâre still both hoping to, but, you know, my first step is always, let me get the script done and then we can talk. Mmhmm. And last question, because the indie film community is so small and so tight-knit. Gary Winick just passed away [one month shy of his 50th birthday after a 2+ year battle with brain cancer and just two months after his older brother Marc died of a heart attack].  You know, a lot of people will look at (the more commercial films he directed like) 13 Going on 30 (or) Letters To Juliet, but his real impact was on independent film-McCarthy: Yeah. -with InDigEnt[Ed. Note: Shortened from âIndependent Digital Entertainment,â InDigEnt was the production company he co-founded with indie film vets John Sloss, Jonathan Sehring and Caroline Kaplan. Tadpole, Personal Velocity, Final, Tape, Chelsea Walls and Pieces Of April were among the higher profile projects for the company which earned one Oscar nomination along with 14 nominations and 2 wins at the Indie Spirit Awards for its films and producers. InDigEntâs business model was just as revolutionary as its films; everyone from production assistants and grips to director and A-list actors got paid the same amount and everyone would share in the profits from the first dollar.]McCarthy: Yeah.What are your lasting memories of him? What do you think his legacy is gonna be?McCarthy: (Pause) I think whatâs interesting about Gary is just what you point out. Right?  Hereâs a guy who is that sort of driving force behind InDigEnt and independent cinema; was such a champion of it. But, then he went on to do all these other (kinds) of films, including (Charlotteâs) Web and mixing it up and heâs a perfect example of a director who was experimenting and trying different things and you might not understand every choice but he didnât care. He was having fun. Anyone who knew him, knew what a lovely guy he was and you know, I was over at Post Factory the other day. I had to stop in there, where we edit the movies. A lot of directors and writers (are) there and editors and there was a lot of talk about Gary and, just like, I hope we can do something to remember him because he was a part of the community and heâll be missed. You know? Itâs sad. Really kind of took the wind out of my sails. Just sad.Do you have a specific personal memory?McCarthy: No. I just knew him from the community. He used to live in my neighborhood. Weâd see each other and never worked together. Saw him last New Yearâs Eve at another friendâs house briefly and chatted with him and, you know, he was struggling. He had been struggling for a while. Yeah.McCarthy: What can you say, but heâll be missed and itâs sad.Yeah.  Thank you so much.McCarthy: Yeah, no, pleasure.
Director Tom McCarthy Talks WIN WIN, THE MILLION DOLLAR ARM, Working for Pixar & Making UP, More
Interview: Director Tom McCarthy talks about WIN WIN, THE MILLION DOLLAR ARM, His Next Pixar Film, The Station Agent, UP, and a lot more.